Bishop Bryan D. Ouellette says he’s performed hundreds of exorcisms. Now, he’s here to tell his story. We talk what really happens during an exorcism, the stages of demonic possession and if demons are actually real. Then, we countdown the Top 5 Celebrities with Animal Names.
Bryan D. Ouellette: 01:08
Pointless: 31:16
Top 5: 51:14
Esoteric Catholic Church
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Interview with Exorcist Bishop Bryan D. Ouellette
Nick VinZant 0:11
Welcome to Profoundly Pointless. My name is Nick VinZant. Coming up in this episode exorcism, and animals celeb celebrities,
Bryan D. Ouellette 0:20
we all experienced this whether we believe in demons or evil or not. And that is that's the yet Sahara experience. So the the I would change with the personality, they were literally physically becoming a different person, this would just be where a place does feels evil.
Nick VinZant 0:42
I want to thank you so much for joining us. If you get a chance, subscribe, leave us a rating or review, we really appreciate it really helps us out. If you're a new listener, welcome to the show. If you're a longtime listener, thank you so much for all of your support. So I want to get right to our first guest. This is exorcist Bishop, Brian De Willette. So how many exorcisms Have you performed?
Bryan D. Ouellette 1:10
Well, I mean, that would be more than I can count, probably. I mean, definitely in the hundreds. But it's important, I think, to note that most exorcisms are not what you you know, associate with like, the movies. You know, those are called solemn exorcisms where, you know, the person is usually pretty bad off, it's usually full blown possession. And it requires all of the resources of the rights of exorcism to resolve those kinds of cases. But those are so rare. We almost never see them. However, minor exorcisms are what we tend to perform more often than not, and that resolves, I'd say 98 99% of all cases that we see.
Nick VinZant 1:53
So when you do an exorcism, right, like let's look at the minor exorcism and then the major exorcism so to speak. What are you doing in a minor exorcism? What are you doing in a major one?
Bryan D. Ouellette 2:06
Well, in a minor one, it's it's shorter. By hours, I'd say a solemn exorcism could take on any given session could take three, four hours to complete. Whereas a minor exorcism can typically be done in less than a half an hour. It's a shorter prayer. It is really just that it's a prayer, a very aggressive prayer where the the person who confers it which is usually going to be a priest, although there are minor exorcisms that are authorized for the laity to us as well. Where the individual affirms their, their Christian authority over dark forces. And that's essentially all it is. With a solemn exorcism or a major exorcism. What you're now doing is having to go through the process of unraveling the onion that is the case typically, this is reserved for possessions only. Minor exorcisms can be performed on any particular kind of disturbance that can be performed on an object, location, or a person. They typically are used for resolving demonic oppressions or obsessions. But possession is usually reserved for the solemn right.
Nick VinZant 3:27
Can you give me an example of like what that prayer would be the minor exorcism prayer?
Bryan D. Ouellette 3:33
Yeah, it's it's your call on the Blessed Virgin you call on St. Michael, the archangel, you call on all of the forces of the church to liberate the object, location or person from the effects of what has been confirmed to be some kind of malevolent spiritual force like a demon. And that's essentially one of the simplest ones that the laity can use. Doesn't have to be an exorcist that praises is the St. Michael prayer St. Michael, the archangel defend us in battle, be our safeguard against the wickedness and snares the devil, may thou rebuke thee, you know, that kind of stuff, and then you just continue on, you know, it's not a long prayer, but you know that these are just things that you can use to facilitate that connection to assist and aid in the clients recovery process, because essentially, as an exercise you are, you know, you are a facilitator. You know, you're not a magician, you're not a wizard, you're not coming in performing incantations, what you're doing is you're facilitating the victim's connection to God.
Nick VinZant 4:50
So, what is the person possessed by
Bryan D. Ouellette 4:54
that's that's an interesting question. I mean, that will vary depending upon who you talk to the conventional Understanding in the churches that this is a a sentient, Fallen Angel, you know that one of these forces of the devil that are out there looking for targets. And so you know, that's where, as an exorcist I have seen demonic entities with my eyes. I've seen them.
Nick VinZant 5:24
How many like what percentage of the people that you would say come to you come to you with an issue that is not worthy of an exorcism?
Bryan D. Ouellette 5:35
Um, I would say, when we started this work, it would have been probably somewhere I mean, this is not a scientific number. It's just Yeah, I do have my own experience. I'd say probably about 60 to 70% When I started this work, but now that I've been on TV, now it's like, probably closer to 90 95% really have a lot of malingerers. Now,
Nick VinZant 5:57
it brings in a certain amount of that. Yeah, it does. It does. So from a religious perspective, and I know that I'm going to get this wrong, it kind of confuses me, I can never quite keep it straight. Right. But from a religious perspective, is this a Christian thing is just a Catholic thing.
Bryan D. Ouellette 6:15
The flavor of it, that we deal with is specifically Christian, but the idea of working with evil forces that need to be resolved through some kind of exorcism process sort of exists in some capacity in every religion, every major religion. And even the minor wants to I mean, shamanism has formulas for dealing with evil spirits. You know, Judaism has ways of negotiating with depicts and evil spirits to raise a family of some kind of attachment that could potentially come up. Islam has methods for working with the jinn that they they they understand them to be different things than what Christianity does, Christianity will of course, see them more as like fallen angels, or, you know, rebellious evil spirits. Whereas Buddhism would say, Well, no, these are the these are the forces of attachment that are here to pull you back into the wheel of samsara, so that you can never liberate yourself. And you're stuck, you know, reincarnating and indefinitely until you finally resolve your karma. And so, but they they do all of these religions see them as external forces that need to be contended with in an external way.
Nick VinZant 7:28
How does the church necessarily look at it? Right? There's the church look at this is like, look, exorcism is a fundamental thing, along with kind of, you know, the basic tenets of the religion, or even within the church, are people kind of like, I don't know about that.
Bryan D. Ouellette 7:45
Yeah, it's changing. There are, of course, people in the church that take it seriously. You know, but there are people in the church that think it's a lot of nonsense. And, you know, these are people that need mental health care. And there are even priests, I've known them. I've, I've been trained by them, you know, that, that will look at exorcism and say, well, that's just, that's just how we would have understood mental illness in the in the ancient world, or in the Middle Ages, we didn't have psychology,
Nick VinZant 8:23
I'll be dramatic and kind of asking the inevitable question, right. But what would you what would you say to somebody who might be listening to this? And just, what are you talking about? Right? Like, what is this, none of this is real, you can't prove any of this.
Bryan D. Ouellette 8:39
It's not about proving it see incorporeal experience, it has to be dealt with at the level of where that individual is at. And so it doesn't matter if it's objectively true to you or not. What matters is a person's having an experience, and it is destroying their life. And the Church and its methods work. So why would we not use it just because you don't believe in it? You're not that important. None of us are, you know, so a person that rejects it, okay, reject it. You know, that's, that's your prerogative. But for the people that actually go through this, they're grateful that there is an individual that cares enough to be able to help them through it. And hopefully, the church is doing its job. And that because that's what it exists to do is to help people through those incorporeal challenges. I mean, so to me, it's irrelevant whether or not people believe it or not, that's not what I don't do this to prove it to myself or to prove it to anyone. I do this because it works. And it's worked for 1000s of years. All these religions around the world know it works, whether they're Christian or not. And I think it's kind of arrogant for us in our modern day to say, Oh, well, we understand it now. And It's all a bunch of nonsense when, you know, billions, if not trillions of people over the last 4000 5000 years, had an understanding about this, and used it and it became part of our reality to the point that all over the world it was it's being utilized. And only today Have we started to say, oh, that's nonsense. I mean, that's arrogant, you're gonna, you're gonna just throw out what all of our ancestors have believed for 5000 years, just because you think you're more enlightened than they are? Maybe you're missing something. So that's kind of how I would answer a person that says, That's me, because it's like, you know, you're kind of missing the point, we're not about proving anything. Yeah, Ghost Hunters are about proving and let them go and prove if they can. I'm not a ghost hunter, you know, I am here to help people with an incorporeal problem. And there is no science that that can objectively work with that. Even psychology fails. And you'd be surprised how many psychologists call us with clients that they will say they've seen things that they can only say, relates to what they've seen in the movies on possession. And they're like, I don't know, if I'm equipped to deal with this. I mean, even once that this is above my paygrade, you know, and they call us. So even psychologists, even medical doctors, I've even had medical doctors call me, not just for their patients, but for themselves. So you know, it's all well and good, and you can dismiss it and not believe in it, until it happens to you. And then, you know, you'll be grateful there are people like me that can that know how to resolve it.
Nick VinZant 11:39
I don't really even know what I necessarily believe. Like, I changed my mind about what I believe all the time. But I would say that I do believe that it doesn't matter if it's real. If you think it's real. Your mind is a powerful thing. Like the reality of it is irrelevant. If somebody really believes this, I
Bryan D. Ouellette 11:58
guess it's true. It is true.
Nick VinZant 12:01
The only thing that I guess would be devil's advocate, I don't know if that's the right word, right. But like, what if you get somebody that is convinced that, okay, it's it's a demon, I'm possessed. And you go about this route, but maybe this person is schizophrenic. I don't know about mental health enough to but you I think you know what I'm asking you, right? Like, what if you go down this road? And it was like, Oh, really? They need this and they need this medication? Right? How does that happen? Is that a concern that you guys have?
Bryan D. Ouellette 12:33
Well, that's why the psychological evaluations are so important. So if a person is diagnosed with a psychotic disorder, like schizophrenia, or bipolar disorder, or acute psychosis, anything like that, then we're just there as as as spiritual support and in the capacity of any pastor, we go, and we pray with them, if they want that, if that's what they want, but they're not going to get an exorcism, the only time we would come in is if there starts to be manifestations that cannot be explained by schizophrenia. And so, if there's, if the person is living in the house, you know, with a family, and the family is experiencing paranormal events, well, schizophrenia shouldn't do that.
Nick VinZant 13:18
Why did you how did you get into this? Like, why did you pursue this
Bryan D. Ouellette 13:23
exorcism? I really didn't. I found my vocation again, I discovered my vocation to priesthood very, I was probably around 16 years old. And I just wanted to keep running away from it because I didn't like the idea of celibacy. You know, as a Roman Catholic priests, I knew I could never be married. And that wasn't attractive to me. I wanted to have a family. And there was other factors, you know, just not I wanted to be an investment banker. So I was like, that's a big difference from you know, being a clergymen. You know, those were my interests, you know, and this was not interesting to me, but it just kept resurfacing and coming back. And eventually, I tried to bridge the gap with psychology, you know, trying to find sort of a more interesting way of pursuing helping people but you know, but it, you know, long story short, I ended up here. But my goal was really just to be a pastor, you know, perform weddings, baptize babies, hear confessions, you know, just do pastoral things. You know, no one chooses, I don't think to say, oh, I want to be an exorcist. So we were getting people coming to us that were asking for this kind of help. But they were being rejected by the Roman Catholic Church locally. And so they said, well, they won't help us. Can you help us? And I said, Well, I mean, my duty as a pastor is to help everyone that steps through my door if I can. So tell me what's going on. And so they explained it and I had had some training in there. When I was a seminary and in the Roman Catholic Church working under a mentor, Pastor Emeritus, was now deceased. And, and I said, Well, I know what to do, I can, I can try to help where, you know, the Roman Catholic Diocese wouldn't. And we've resolved it, you know, and I guess work it out, and they started telling people, and then other people started coming to us. And before we know it, people were coming to us more for this than anything else. And as a pastor, my obligation is to just help people spiritually wherever they're at, and that's what they needed. So that's kind of how I fell into this work. And, and that's how I got started. So yeah, I mean, it kind of fell into it out of necessity, not because I chose to do it.
Nick VinZant 15:44
Are you ready for some harder slash listener submitted questions? Let's do it. Are there different stages of demonic possession?
Bryan D. Ouellette 15:52
Oh, yes, definitely. The general stages that we look at, and of course, they don't necessarily follow this in some kind of linear order. And it's not like it will always be the same pattern every time it can, there can sometimes be full blown possession right off the as the first manifestation, although that's exceptionally rare. But it's typically the stages that we look for SAS would be the first and most simple would be just basically what I call demonic interference. And that's what we all experienced this, whether we believe in demons or evil or not. And that is, that's the yet Sahara experience that's like, you know, going through and doing something, but all of a sudden, like, there's this kind of negative voice in the back your subconscious saying, I should do this, this would be better, even though you know, it's wrong. So anytime you get a temptation to do the wrong thing, which we all have experienced at some point in our life, and you're lying to yourself, if you think you haven't, that would be demonic interference. That would be sort of the first stage, honestly, because in a lot of cases, that if that's allowed to progress, if a person is allowed to indulge us too much in those temptations, it can, it can, it can include a a sort of upward spiral, or I should say, downward spiral into deeper forms of, of demonic activity. So the second is, the more is more severe, and that's going to be like demonic obsession. And demonic obsession is when it affects mostly their eat their psyche and their emotional centers, but doesn't really have any physical manifestation at all. They're, they're usually in good health, there's nothing else going on. But they're every everything that they're experiencing seems to be psychological, this is a very difficult stage, because this is almost indistinguishable from mental illness. The third would be demonic oppression. And that's where it can look a lot like possession. But it's not the person still has control over their own faculties. But now it starts to affect their external world, it starts to affect their family, it starts to affect their health. And then the last stage is possession. So that's going to be when they no longer have control over their faculties where they truly lose themselves in this in this evil persona that sort of takes over and speaks for them and controls them and completely destroys their life and their relationships. There's a subcategory that's kind of related, but is its own thing. And that would be a demonic infestation, that tends to affect people through either oppression or obsession, or could even relate to possession. But it's when an environment is has the attachments that of a person. And these are really interesting, because what this shows us is that the energy is tangible to the point that it's not just all in someone's head, if one wants to see it that way. It does have some kind of externalization, there are places that this energy exists, and it makes people extremely sick when they coexist in those environments for too long. So that's kind of all the stages, that's what we're looking for, when we're trying to determine whether or not there's a genuine demonic event going on. It's gonna fall into one of those five categories,
Nick VinZant 19:25
the infestation, but can you give me an example of that, like a place that you've seen, or
Bryan D. Ouellette 19:31
this would just be where a place does feels evil? You know, I mean, to the lay person going in, they might say, I get a bad feeling in that place. I don't like it there. I don't want to go back there and they don't know why they might they might, they might believe in demons. They might not. But they'll just usually anybody, even an atheist could go in and say, there's just something that's unpleasant about this. And they might try to find tangible reasons for why they might feel that way. But when you're there, it feels dark. It feels disturbing. It can give people anxiety, it can raise their blood pressure when they're in these places. And there's just something disturbed about it. And I think there's, you know, places where there has been a lot of trauma. in pop culture contexts, it might just get labeled as a haunting, or, you know, something of that nature, you might say, Amityville would be a good example, if you want to. I mean, not that I believe Amityville was a real thing. I don't, I really don't. I think that was a made up story. But if it were a real story, if it did happen the way it was reported, then that would be an example of a demonic infestation, a trauma happened there, murders, and, you know, family murders, you know, kids were killed. And there was residual energy that sort of took on a life of its of its own, and so that new people would move in and be affected. The reason I don't believe it is that only the lens has ever said there was anything going on, there was a lot of holes to their story. And everybody that's lived in the house after that has reported nothing. Worst case you've ever had, well, any full blown possession. So I think I can't really say there's one worse than another, they're all They're all difficult, they're all unpleasant to witness, they're hard to resolve. Once it gets to that point. It can take months or even years, I guess the part of my work that is a little magical, you know, it sort of works outside of the will of the person is that I can bring them back to, to awareness, you know, so when if a person's far too far gone into a possession, where only the demon is talking, then the rights of exorcism can bring them back to a certain stage of coherence, where you can then reason with them. And that's when you really have to do your work. Okay, all these prayers, and holy water is all great and they're all but the real work is getting them sober again, bring them back to a state of, of sobriety, awareness, and then being able to be like, Okay, now I need you to work with me, I need you to help me. Let's, let's purge this from your life.
Nick VinZant 22:10
So when we talk about like a full possession, what does that look like? What does that really look like?
Bryan D. Ouellette 22:17
Okay, so it's a lot like the movies, you know. So if we're going to use like, the actresses like Linda Blair is sort of the archetype of possession. It's a lot like that only, that's more exaggerated than what we would really see. So you're never going to see head spinning. I've never encountered that you're not going to see levitation to the ceiling. But you will see some of that profane behavior, the vulgarity, the nasty, you know, verbal attacks against the priests or sacrilege, you know, that they will sometimes say, there will be that guttural sort of beastly voice that can sometimes come out of people that you're you could not fathom that they could make those noises, or sound like that. I've seen children, young girls, maybe younger than Linda Blair, in that movie, talk with a deep masculine voice that just like there's just no way their vocal cords could produce that sound. You'll sometimes see words, not quite like, where it comes out in this three dimensional helped me, but there'll be like scratches on the on the body that will form letters that can turn into words, or symbols. speaking in languages that they have never learned, is something that we will sometimes see not always but sometimes, sometimes you'll hear more than one voice coming out. And that's always an interesting manifestation. Because how could you be saying two different things from the same voice? And that's when there's more than one presence, which is often you know, one of the things that you want to know is not only getting their name, but you want to know how many are there. And how many do you have to expel? It's not really expelling it's more like dissolving but that's another story. As far as as, you know, everything else it's it's what you kind of would expect they're violent, they're angry. They're disturbed. They can go stiff as a board. They can increase in strength far beyond what a person of their stature could could normally produce. I've seen little old ladies be able to really wrestle you out with wrestle Five Guys, I've seen children. Knock two guys over or, you know, with just moving their arm? I mean, it can be very exaggerated in that respect. But, you know, you know what, when you see it, it's wouldn't be shocking in the sense. I mean, it'd be shocking, because you'd be like, I didn't know this could actually really happen. But it wouldn't shock you like, this is so different than I thought it would be. No, you'd be like, Yeah, this is kind of what I expected. It's just kind of shocking that you're seeing it with your own eyes and not on a television screen with an actor,
Nick VinZant 25:32
right? I mean, I would be like, Oh, my God, how would get out of there? I'm done. I'm out here. Do you get scared?
Bryan D. Ouellette 25:41
No, no, I've never never been frightened by anything that I've done in this work. It just doesn't bother me, though. I know, there are people that do get bothered by it. We've had people that once they've had that one big case, they've never come back. We've had people that could not control the effects of doing this work for the long term and have slowly develop their own attachments. Or more accurately, I should say, some of the darkness that has already latent within them has started to surface through having been exposed to this kind of energy on a regular basis, and not taking the proper spiritual precautions to avoid that from happening. And then they have to leave, you know, so we're a very small team. Now, I used to have like, gosh, I used to have like 10 or 10, over 10 people. And now we, I pretty much work with three or four, then if it's a, if it's a case with a actual possession, then we might bring in a couple extra guys to hold the victim down, if they get violent, because that can just one of the things that these that the demonic entity will always try to do is, is distract, they will always try to stop and interrupt the process. So you need to reduce the the the potential for that by having other people that are there to kind of just hold them down so that I can just do my work. But you know, there's been cases where I've had to wrestle the client myself, you know, because we just don't have the manpower. I try to avoid those situations, but I'm perfectly capable of doing it about half two. And we've done that a few times.
Nick VinZant 27:34
This one kind of ended, I guess on a slightly lighter note, um, movie with the best description of it, movie with kind of the worst description of it.
Bryan D. Ouellette 27:45
Well, the worst one I've seen in recent time was the Pope's exorcist that was just horrible. Not only was it inaccurate, but it was just a terrible movie. Very disappointed in that I expected more from Russell Crowe. The best one, I don't know if it's the best pick action. But it's, it was fairly accurate in many ways. And that was the right was Anthony Hopkins. I would say that's a really good I mean, as good as Hollywood's gonna get it in terms of that respect. Also, the exorcist isn't bad. It's just, again, it's exaggerated. But a lot of the things you see in there, not the crab walk that was like deleted and then put in in the special edition. You know, that kind of stuff doesn't typically happen. Not the levitation to the ceiling, and all of the things I already mentioned. But as far as like the way that the person looks sick, and that their physical face faces, you know, the physical face changes, and they're not the person they used to be. That's all very accurate. The priests resolution in that movie was absolutely completely wrong. You never would say, Take me dammit, take me, you know, and then jump out the window to kill it. That's not how that is not an effective exorcism. And that would be honestly laughable to be like, you had no business being an exorcist to begin with. If that's your solution. Now, you would stay there and fight it out until that person is liberated. And if you're not strong enough to do that, then you have no business doing the work to begin with. So that was the only part because that was for dramatic effect, right? They had to make something crazy go on. So you can forgive it on the basis that it's a good story. But everything else was actually quite well done. I haven't seen the new one, the new exorcist film that's in theaters now. I want to see it I've seen them all. In fact, we were were talking about I've had the the full collection. This used to be the definitive collection, but now they have the new movie. So yeah, they got pretty good. I mean, again, they're fanciful. They're exaggerations of the truth. But there is like bits and pieces of accuracy in there. And yeah, I liked them there. They're they're enjoyable movies to watch.
Nick VinZant 30:01
That's pretty much all the questions we got if I mean, what's kind of coming up next for you? How can people get a hold of you if they need help that kind of stuff?
Bryan D. Ouellette 30:10
Yeah, well, we have a website esoteric catholic.org, you can also just go directly to nickelodeon.org nic holean.org. They're both the same site, just different URLs to get you there. And there's a contact form there. There's a request and investigation form. There's a lot of information about the things that we do. One thing I always encourage people to do is to watch our podcast at vestiges after dark. It's every Tuesday when and season at 8pm. Eastern, you can just get there directly by going to youtube at Nickelodeon, again, Nic h o l e n, or just clicking on the links on the website on esoteric catholic.org. We're also it's a podcast so that if you want to see the video version, you can watch it on YouTube Live. If you want to listen to the podcast version, you can listen live on Spreaker. Or you can just wait until the show is finished. And then usually about a half hour later it shows up on all the platforms.
Nick VinZant 31:14
I want to thank Bishop well that so much for joining us if you want to connect with him, we have linked to him on our social media sites. We're Profoundly Pointless on Tik Tok, Instagram and YouTube. And we've also included his information in the episode description. The YouTube version of this interview will be live on October 19 at 4:30pm Pacific. Okay, now let's bring in John Shaw and get to the pointless part of the show. Have you ever seen or experienced something that you could not explain? No. Huh? There was a little bit of hesitation there.
John Shull 31:56
I mean, I had one experience when I was a teenager that I have no idea how it happens. But it happened, but I mean, it's it's not even a good story. Me and my friend. Were watching horror movies. At like, 3am I had a latch on my door as a kid. And the latch unlocked itself.
Nick VinZant 32:15
Oh, but did the door like move or anything like that?
John Shull 32:20
Yeah, the door kind of swung open a little bit. But you know, I mean, it's, I don't know, my window was open was kind of a windy night. Would it have been that windy to unlatch? A door? Probably not. But there has to be a reason because, you know, you're gonna I'm gonna go on a whole rant here. All I'm gonna say is Bigfoot isn't real. And probably neither are ghosts. I'm sorry to ruin everyone's Halloween.
Nick VinZant 32:47
Yeah, my thing with ghosts is if there was actually ghosts, I looked this up, right? I looked this up because I was bored one day, and I just was thinking about this, but I looked this up. There's been 128 billion people that they think have existed on Earth at one time. If there was actually ghosts, there will be so many ghosts. Like it wouldn't even be a question. If there were ghosts. there'd be so many of them. They'd be everywhere.
John Shull 33:13
Yes, first off, I agree 100% of that if there was a Sasquatch, if there was a Bigfoot, they would have been seen by now there would have been one documented case of these things actually being seen or found. Same with ghosts if there were really ghosts, there are really demons that can inhabit your brain. It would have been proven by now.
Nick VinZant 33:35
My only thing with that kind of stuff is you have to be either or like if you believe in this one thing you've got to believe in all of it. You got to believe in all the possibilities right? Like if you believe in ghosts then you got to believe and then you can't be there and be like well but demons that's it total BS. Like if you believe in one you've got to acknowledge the possibility of all of them.
John Shull 33:58
I mean, they usually kind of go hand in hand I think with you know if you believe in demons you believe in ghosts if you believe in the Megalodon you believe in the Loch Ness monster,
Nick VinZant 34:07
but do you have one out there conspiracy theory? Do you have one thing that like this is the only thing of that realm or ilk or whatever? That like, oh, I kind of I kind of think this might be true.
John Shull 34:19
Maybe Bigfoot because maybe it's just some deformed bear species that you know no one's ever been able to catch me. There's like six of them. And they just keep having Bigfoot babies. I don't know. Sasquatch like but once again I believe like you know like the dinosaurs right? There is at least existence like there's you know bones that they existed. That I mean there's nothing for any of these any of these. It's all folklore. It's a folklore. It's all Greek mythology. But modern day.
Nick VinZant 34:53
The only one that I kind of like oh, maybe would be the idea that we're living in a simulation. Because when I think wind I hear about like space and things like that. I'm like, no, no, the sun's not like 90. That's too big of a thing for me to even comprehend. In my mind, that would be the only reason I'd be like, if that turned out to be true. I don't think that I would be super shocked. I'd be like, you know, if I found that out after I died, I would be like, you know, I always kind of wondered,
John Shull 35:23
like, what if I'm an actor? What if you're an actor? What if our wives aren't even in love with us? What if they just play a role? And then like, you know, in 10 years, they're just gonna leave us and go be with their real families.
Nick VinZant 35:36
That would be kind of crazy. Actually, if you think about it, that like one day, people were just like, You know what, man, this is all fake. This was just a movie we were filming. We're out of here.
John Shull 35:46
Maybe our children aren't even ours. And like, you know, I don't who knows?
Nick VinZant 35:50
I just feel like if that was true, my life would be more dramatic. Like there's not I don't think that a reality TV show based around my life would be that interesting.
John Shull 36:01
Yeah, unless, like you're set up to fail, and you just keep continually choosing the right path.
Nick VinZant 36:06
Right? Like, it's a real slow burn that like one day, he's gonna get it wrong. And it turns out, this is the guy that like, dooms the human race, and we're just watching to see how it happens.
John Shull 36:17
Yeah, like, maybe you are maybe like the eye of the beholder. And for all, you know, like, You are the key to unlocking of a galaxy. And everyone's like, is this week, the week that he's finally going to eat peanut butter instead of rubbing it on his balls?
Nick VinZant 36:32
I mean, I don't, I don't, I don't know how to read and respond to that, because I was kind of like, not listening. And then the only last thing I got was peanut butter on his balls. And I was just like, I know, I don't know what to say,
John Shull 36:44
you need to become a better listener, you know that you're wanting to become a more you need to become a more astute play.
Nick VinZant 36:51
I'll be there in a minute. Now, what are we saying? I'm saying, I
John Shull 36:59
see, that's exactly what I'm talking about.
Nick VinZant 37:01
D could you ever foresee a situation in which somehow in the annals of history, like the human race is doomed? And it all comes back to like it was turns out, it was John Shaw, who did it? Like they trace it back? And they're like, do you never feel like you can make one decision that could do in the human race?
John Shull 37:21
No, and I'm not even entirely sure that one person holds that power. And I'm not saying this to bring up terrible memories, because we know what's currently going on in the world. But there have been some really terrible human beings that have tried to plot things out to, you know, get rid of certain races of people. And even that has never worked. So I don't think that I'm going to be the one person that dooms humanity,
Nick VinZant 37:45
right, but it's always the bullet, you don't see common, right? You making a decision one day, and you set off a chain reaction, because you didn't check your blinker, your rearview mirror, and you cause this thing that causes the end of all of the Detroit.
John Shull 37:59
I mean, it would be kind of wild, like if I, you know, I'm driving and I accidentally sideswiped a van carrying a nuclear bomb that goes off, and then someone overseas thinks we're firing one, and then they fire one. And
Nick VinZant 38:11
that would be pretty, right. Like it could be the destruction of America could be potentially traced back to like one random person who made a mistake.
John Shull 38:20
I don't I don't really want to think about that. Because I want to be driving really cautiously. The next few days,
Nick VinZant 38:25
you could make a decision at any moment that could set off a domino effect that could doom the entire civilization.
John Shull 38:31
Well, I don't first of all, I don't think it's that dramatic.
Nick VinZant 38:34
I think it is, I think it could happen.
John Shull 38:37
No, I think you can have a series of events that can like ruin your world and other people's worlds, but I don't, I don't know that there's anything that I could be involved in that I could doom the human race with. So
Nick VinZant 38:47
we had somebody that was on here a little while ago, we had a space weather researcher, and they talked about the idea that there has to be people all over the place that closely monitor what is happening with the Sun and solar storms? Well, what if that person goes to the bathroom and like somebody else called out sick, and then in that 15 minutes, there's a solar storm that wipes out all technology on the face of the earth? Well, they didn't, because they weren't there to like shut down the equipment.
John Shull 39:13
There's always a backup to the backup, right? You can always mess up and pretty much any profession. And it's not the end of the world.
Nick VinZant 39:21
I'm as guilty as this as anybody. So when I say this, consider the fact that I include myself in this, there's one thing we can do, we can fuck something up. We can make a small mistake that will like cause all kinds of problems.
John Shull 39:36
I sure hope that whoever monitoring the sun right now is actually paying attention. Because that is kind of scary,
Nick VinZant 39:41
right? You look across you look across your screen one day, and then all of a sudden you're like, oh, wait, hey, what's gonna take a shit like, Hey, Tim, watch this YouTube video. Oh, man. Right.
John Shull 39:54
Yeah, I mean, you say I mean yes. You say that way that that could be It can be kind of scary.
Nick VinZant 40:01
Yeah, think about it. Okay.
John Shull 40:03
Oh God, I don't think it'd be world ending but it would still be pretty disastrous right that
Nick VinZant 40:09
big rocks not gonna do anything that dinosaurs just a big just one big rock
John Shull 40:17
when you think there's just one rock, you think it was two rocks?
Nick VinZant 40:19
I think it was probably just one rock and roll.
John Shull 40:23
Well, that must have been a gigantic rock.
Nick VinZant 40:25
That was a huge rock that is surprising that how little we kind of know about that right? Like, wait a minute what happened? That's gonna happen. Anybody you never think like, oh, you never think that's gonna happen to the human race? Be like,
John Shull 40:38
oh, I mean, that's what's gonna happen. At some point, there's going to be some kind of, you know, world ending something event where there'll be an asteroid again,
Nick VinZant 40:47
eventually everybody dies. Alright, let's move on.
John Shull 40:49
Hold on, do you think you'll ever see that event in our lifetime where something resets the human race?
Nick VinZant 40:59
No, well, I've said this before. So I'll make this really quick. I do live in Seattle, which is supposed to be the next time there's a big earthquake here is supposed to be the largest natural disaster of all time. So that's basically forecast to happen kind of any day now within the next 50 years. It's like a real concern here. It's a real problem. I can see something that resets it like for my life, like you're going back to zero. But my thing is, the the problem that gets you is never the one that you see, see coming. The thing that you are worried about is never as bad as it seems. And the thing that you don't think is a big deal is always much worse than it is.
John Shull 41:39
All right. Let's move on to some shout outs now, shall we? Yeah. All right. Let's say we're gonna start with an easy one here, Greg book would Darrow Ron Keogh,
Nick VinZant 41:50
Darrell or Darrow? Darrell? Oh, Darrell.
John Shull 41:56
Andrew Kim, huh. Derek Reed. Doug Bruce two first names for a entire name.
Nick VinZant 42:06
Both both names that are similar. I put Doug and Bruce on the same tier level of names and the same type of guy could be named either Doug or Bruce.
John Shull 42:17
Okay, Cam Sutton Nima and a serie Michael Wilford. Trey sneers. And Derek, dealer. Congratulations,
Nick VinZant 42:29
then a lot of Derek's on a lot of Derek's on the shout outs lately. I think there's been too many Derrick's for how many Derek's exist in society.
John Shull 42:38
Well, we appreciate every Derrick every person. And you know what? I'm gonna I'm gonna go off kilter for one second and say you know what, congratulations to you. Nick VinZant.
Nick VinZant 42:47
Congratulations to you. Do you want to tell the people?
John Shull 42:49
I mean, listen, we are I don't know how it happened. I've absolutely no idea. We actually won two different awards. We weren't last. Oh, and we got we got like an editor's choice award or something. A signal Award, which is a pretty prestigious podcasting award. So yeah, I mean, it's almost like winning an Emmy. Like we just won an Emmy for podcasting.
Nick VinZant 43:10
Yeah, to give the official title, I believe we were the signal Award winner for best interview podcast.
John Shull 43:18
Absolutely something that I have no part of, but you're kind of interviewing me now. So I'll count that it's because of me, I would
Nick VinZant 43:24
consider that to be an extenuation of the show, right? You know, what, if you play in the foot doesn't matter if you play in the game at all, you're still winning, right? You may not play in the first half, you may not play in the second half. But if you see the field that counts is a win for you.
John Shull 43:37
So congratulations, those those judges, I hope listen to the worst episode imaginable, but loved it still so good for them good on them.
Nick VinZant 43:45
Do you think it's because we're good, or because everybody else was that terrible,
John Shull 43:48
though? Oh, man. I mean, I want to say it's because we're, we're that you know, everyone else was terrible. But to our credit, we were I mean, we were in a stacked category with like, high profile names and podcasts. And we were still picked out and given an award. So maybe we are good. Maybe maybe we're better than we think. I don't know
Nick VinZant 44:10
if I was Jon Stewart, or the lady from Seinfeld, Julia Louis Dreyfus, I always forget her name until just now I would fire my staff. Be like these people these two. Imagine like your Kevin Hart, who's also somebody we beat out or Jon Stewart, who is also somebody we beat out. I imagine that they're like, I wonder what this is who puts this together? And they look it up and it's me and you? Like how pissed off would you be if you like, What the I lost to this? It would be like a professional basketball team losing to like the a high school team that has five people's five people in a city with 100 people.
John Shull 44:50
I mean, it really, I mean, this really is a one and a half person operation. I'm not gonna even count myself as a full person. And yeah, some of those podcasts have 20 people 30 Uh, yeah. So yeah, I don't know if I was Jon Stewart, Kevin Hart that next morning, my first question would be, well, well, how did they win? And then my, my third question would be maybe I should offer them jobs.
Nick VinZant 45:10
But it's not technically a question. Statement.
John Shull 45:15
Can we offer them jobs?
Nick VinZant 45:17
Should I offer them?
John Shull 45:20
Alright, let's do some I got some bangers for you. Boy, okay. Would you rather have no eyebrows? Or no nose?
Nick VinZant 45:32
Well, no, no, no eyebrows, I can just draw the eyebrows on. If you've got no nose, there's not like a lot that you can do with that. The nose is a very central feature to people's faces. Have you ever
John Shull 45:45
seen somebody with drawn on eyebrows? It doesn't look normal.
Nick VinZant 45:50
Yeah, but I mean, it doesn't look less normal than not having a nose.
John Shull 45:57
I just feel like you're under estimating what the eyebrows do for your, your expressions.
Nick VinZant 46:04
I think that you're under estimating what your nose does.
John Shull 46:08
I mean, I have a pretty good nose. I just glanced at looking at it in the camera.
Nick VinZant 46:13
I'd still go back to the thing about if I have big ears or not. I can never decide. Like, yeah,
John Shull 46:19
I've been told I have gigantic ears.
Nick VinZant 46:21
Oh, I thought you actually had little ears? I would say I would describe them as little ears. I would err.
John Shull 46:27
A gigantic head.
Nick VinZant 46:28
Ah, yeah, that's true. That's true. Throws it off.
John Shull 46:32
You know what they say about gigantic heads?
Nick VinZant 46:36
Takes a big hat. cover that up?
John Shull 46:38
Yeah, yeah, pretty much just need a big hat. All right. So that one didn't go as expected. Let's try this one. Okay, would you? What would you be more fearful of running out of gas in the desert at night? Or being stuck on the top floor of a building with no way down? Hmm.
Nick VinZant 47:02
Well, running out of the gas in the middle of desert, you could probably die. That can get you in a lot of trouble. I used to live in Arizona, I made the mistake one time of hiking and 110 degree heat. And by hiking I mean, basically just kind of like walking around in a small park that wasn't like really out in the wilderness. And I probably about 30 minutes into it like, Oh, this isn't normal. I wouldn't mess with the desert man. Don't mess with water, either too much of it or not enough of it.
John Shull 47:32
I mean, you know, I don't want to put Michigan back on the map here. But trust me, you're gonna, according to all the, you know, all the research apparently in Michigan is going to become the migration capital of the world when the earth starts officially heating up to the point of no return because we are just surrounded by bodies of water.
Nick VinZant 47:55
Well, that's what it's going to take to get anybody to live in Michigan. The end of the world is the only thing that will get people to come back to Detroit. That's just literally people are going to have to be like, do you want to? The only way I'm moving to Detroit is if it's the end of the world. It's the end of the world. Okay.
John Shull 48:13
As you're talking about a city that may be wrecked forever because of a you know, an earthquake.
Nick VinZant 48:19
Yeah, but people still want to live in Seattle. It's like it's got mountains in the ocean, man. It's not got like, like, what do you got to field there? I think in Detroit, you have like an empty parking lot that people can have fun in.
John Shull 48:32
We have a football team that is doing very well. Thank you very much. Okay.
Nick VinZant 48:35
Didn't give me an event that I could go back. Big money.
John Shull 48:43
Let's see here. Last one. Halloween. How much is too much to spend on a costume? Garbage? $50 or $100?
Nick VinZant 48:55
You're asking me dude. Okay, I'm one of the cheapest people I think that most people ever met, I would say that $10 Or you should be able to make a costume with what you have in your house. I have never really understood people who invested a lot of time and energy in costumes. That to me has always been like,
John Shull 49:15
you can even buy kid costumes for under $50.
Nick VinZant 49:19
I mean, we got one. It was like 10 bucks. It was a link costume of eBay. or Amazon or one of those things. I've just never I've never really gotten into like the whole that's just too much work for Halloween.
John Shull 49:33
hasn't arrived yet this link costume? Yeah,
Nick VinZant 49:36
actually, I think he got it for Christmas because he wanted that and then we just repurposed it. My other son is going to be a tiger and we're just going to paint his face. What was what was your What was your favorite costume? Halloween costume? Your rent?
John Shull 49:47
My favorite prom probably being the Pillsbury Doughboy. How old were you? Seven or eight. I don't even remember.
Nick VinZant 49:56
That's traumatizing. I feel like that shouldn't have neck. Somebody shouldn't have allowed that. that
John Shull 50:00
I actually kind of vetoed Halloween. I don't remember going out after that until I became like a teenager. Yeah, I do. And I could see why. Yeah, yeah, that was kind of terrifying.
Nick VinZant 50:10
Sucks to Ubu. I don't know if that lifts you up?
Unknown Speaker 50:16
No, of course, is
Nick VinZant 50:17
that not an uplifting statement sucks to be.
John Shull 50:21
It's how the simulation we're living in, of course.
Nick VinZant 50:25
But what if it's just like who's simulation? Do you think we would be in my simulation or yours simulation right now?
John Shull 50:33
Maybe yours? I don't know. That's a great question.
Nick VinZant 50:37
Yeah, probably mine.
John Shull 50:39
Maybe we're both in, in a simulation. And they're just combined together.
Nick VinZant 50:44
What if we're in pods right next to each other right now? Like, we're in the matrix, and we're just sitting next to each other.
John Shull 50:51
Oh, my God, right. Like, what if we never left Florida?
Nick VinZant 50:55
What if we're not even in Florida? What if we're in space? We're just floating around in space? Because the Earth is destroyed. And they gotta man. That's so crazy.
John Shull 51:07
Yeah, like, what have my back pain is really just like that thing being plugged into my back somewhere.
Nick VinZant 51:13
Okay, are you ready for a top five?
John Shull 51:16
I am. And this I don't know, people were very disappointed in us. From what I understood about our lack of being able to come up with this top five list last week when we were kind of putting each other on the spot, so intro it and then we'll get to it.
Nick VinZant 51:32
So our top five is top five celebrities named after animals or top five celebrities with animal names. However you want to put that together either way. What's your number five.
John Shull 51:44
My number five is going to be Larry Bird and Sue bird.
Nick VinZant 51:48
Hmm. Okay, I think that's pretty low for Larry Bird. I think that he needs to be a little bit higher up on that list. I'm not sure if if Sue board Sue bird may be a legend in her sport, but I don't think that she has the overall kind of notoriety for making it up that high. That's my personal opinion.
John Shull 52:06
I agree with you. But you know, at the same point, they're both basketball players. They're both Hall of Famers or I don't know if she is willing to be anything so yeah, but yeah, so I'm alright with that. Larry and Sue bird breaking down.
Nick VinZant 52:19
Tony Hawk. My number five is Tony Hawk.
John Shull 52:23
See I think that's too high on the list for for Tony Hawk. I think that he deserves a higher spot.
Nick VinZant 52:31
I think that you didn't fully think out the animal names thing. And there's going to be that your son that you're gonna be like, Oh, I forgot about that one. I didn't think of that one. Okay, what's your number for? Seal? Does anyone know his real name?
John Shull 52:51
No, I think that's part of it. I wonder what his real what is
Nick VinZant 52:55
his real name? That's one of the few people that you only know their first name seal. Prince. Madonna. I don't think Madonna is her real name. That's obviously not her real name. What is Madonna's real name? You look up seals. We'll name all look up Madonna's real name.
John Shull 53:13
Well, I picked the hard one because seal has six names. Oh god. Seal Henry. A Lowe's gun. All you might a Dola Samuel o seals. Full Name.
Nick VinZant 53:26
Madonna has four names Madonna. Luis Veronica. Silicone, a CIC? O n e sicne. She's Italian. Oh, all right. Bay City, Michigan. Where's that? Yeah. Do you even know? Yeah, it's
John Shull 53:42
about an hour and a half north of the metro Detroit. area.
Nick VinZant 53:47
Okay. Okay. My number four is a tie between Michael J. Fox and Jamie Foxx. I think that Michael J. Fox would have been the more famous of the two had his illness not happened. But now I think you got to put Michael J Fox and Jamie Foxx on the same level.
John Shull 54:05
You know, I I thought about putting at least Michael J. Fox, Jamie Foxx or you can make an argument 204 But I they just barely missed the cut for me for top five.
Nick VinZant 54:16
I'm gonna have to see what's on yours because that's a pretty I mean, my number three is Larry Bird.
John Shull 54:26
My number three is Snoop Dogg.
Nick VinZant 54:28
Oh, but not his real name, though.
John Shull 54:33
No, but I mean, I think it's fair enough. I mean, no one knows him. If you can't tell me his real name, then he goes by his stage name
Nick VinZant 54:42
Calvin Broadus. I didn't look that up, but I think that his real name is Calvin Broadus.
John Shull 54:47
Yeah, I know. He's, I mean less. I know. It's one of the more famous ones that we know, but I'm sticking with it. Snoop Dogg has my number three
Nick VinZant 54:54
it is Calvin Broadus Calvin core days or Broadus, Jr.
John Shull 55:00
All these long elongated names
Nick VinZant 55:03
that's the secret man, everybody you got to if you want to be a big I don't know, I agree with you on Snoop Dogg. I don't feel like that should quite count. That's my personal opinion. That was my number I again my number three is Larry Bird was number two.
John Shull 55:17
So my number two this workouts my number one is as unanimous I think you have the same number one as it were, you should. But my number two I have Tony Hawk is my number two. Okay.
Nick VinZant 55:28
I have Robin Williams. Okay,
John Shull 55:31
all right. I see I once again i It's tough for me and that number five spot. I was like, so many choices.
Nick VinZant 55:39
I don't know Robin Williams. I don't know how you leave Robin Williams off the list, honestly.
John Shull 55:44
Yeah, I mean, maybe, maybe pushing number one. My number one is Tiger Woods.
Nick VinZant 55:50
Yeah, Tiger Woods. I think Tiger Woods is the most famous person named after an animal. What
John Shull 55:56
I love is that we both had completely different two through fives. But it's like yeah, number one is unanimous.
Nick VinZant 56:02
Tiger Woods was probably one of the probably the most famous person in the world at one time. And he changed the game that he played in and even after how many years since he's been really really good. He's still a big draw. Like I'll watch a golf tournament because Tiger Woods is playing with no caring of what anything else like Go Tigers playing.
John Shull 56:26
Yeah, I mean for what he was able to do and the crowd he was able to draw like yeah, it's that's not even part of it. Just he has it's a cool name. His name is first name is Tiger. I mean, that's awesome.
Nick VinZant 56:37
Which is crazy because his first name and he's like his name is Tiger. But his other name is eldritch which is like the exact opposite, right? Like give him a cool name. And then a really dorky name. Watching your honorable mention I have so many good ones in my model. Honorable mention.
John Shull 56:54
You mentioned a few. So it's and you have a bunch of said to that I'll throw out there Raven Simone. Oh, that's a good one. I didn't think of that. And Bear Gryllus
Nick VinZant 57:06
I don't know who that is. I have heard that name. But I've never actually seen that person or anything that he's ever done.
John Shull 57:14
I mean, he's really famous as being an outdoorsman, and survivalist and all that. But, you know, if you don't watch a lot of cable TV, you probably wouldn't have access to him. I would imagine. I really thought his name was Bear Grylls appears real. Maybe it's grills. I'm pretty sure it's grill us though.
Nick VinZant 57:33
Okay, I'm going to start I'm going to you just tell me. No, I'm just gonna start saying I'm Lance Bass.
Unknown Speaker 57:41
Yeah, yes.
Nick VinZant 57:43
Continue on the fish theme, Mike Trout. Yep. Switching it up a little bit. John Cougar Mellencamp.
John Shull 57:53
Okay, all right. I like that. Yep. One you
Nick VinZant 57:56
may not think of but then once you realize you're like, Oh, yeah. Jay Leno.
John Shull 58:04
Okay, all right. Yeah.
Nick VinZant 58:05
Jay Leno is a good one, right. You don't necessarily
John Shull 58:09
associate the two but yeah, okay.
Nick VinZant 58:12
Wolf Blitzer.
John Shull 58:16
Oh, that's a good one. That is a good,
Nick VinZant 58:17
that's a good one to name I think what's real name? That takes balls, especially of all the guys like that's not a guy was Wolf, Isaac Blitzer. That's his real name. Wow. That takes some balls, especially he was born in 1948. So somebody in the 1950s was like that kid's name is Wolf.
John Shull 58:41
Which means Yeah, I mean, I had a couple more.
Nick VinZant 58:44
I'll go further. Oh, go for
John Shull 58:46
a baby. Megan Fox.
Nick VinZant 58:49
Yeah, not the same tear as any other foxes. But yes. Sheryl Crow. Oh, yeah. That's she she could make a run for it. She could make a run for it.
John Shull 59:01
In my personal favorites, Newt Gingrich.
Nick VinZant 59:05
Yeah. Yeah. Um, this one's older Florence Nightingale.
John Shull 59:12
Florence Nightingale, okay. Yeah. Yep.
Nick VinZant 59:15
I think he was a singer. He may was used as a singer or he was an actor, but Adam ain't.
John Shull 59:20
Yeah, at a man he wasn't. He wasn't
Nick VinZant 59:23
a singer. Oh, okay. That's gonna go ahead and do it for this episode of Profoundly Pointless. I want to thank you so much for joining us. If you get a chance, leave us a quick review. We really appreciate it doesn't have to be some big thing. Just a couple of quick words. And let us know who you think are some of the best celebrities with animal names. I think it's really hard to be Tiger Woods. I think he's a clear number one. Robin Williams can give him a run for the money. But after that, there's a lot of people that could go in that top five Live